Is Patrick Jane Red John

Could it possibly be that the great enigma of The Mentalist TV series is that the protagonist and the antagonist are actually the same human being?

Is Patrick Jane the very criminal mastermind he is so obsessed with hunting? A split personality?

How do we explain the second season finale “Red Sky In The Morning”?  This episode shows the first time Patrick Jane and Red John actually come face-to-face, and Red John cites a few lines from William Blake’s poem “The Tyger”

click2play3 Is Patrick Jane Red John

Patrick Jane Faces Red John For The First Time

The first verse of the poem, the words cited by Red John were:

TYGER, tyger, burning bright  
In the forests of the night,  
What immortal hand or eye  
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?

What does this mean? It’s definitely a big clue, and in the context of the “Patrick Jane is Red John” theory, the events in the video and the poem could mean at least some of the following:

1) The masked person is an accomplice that may or may not know that Patrick Jane is Red John and is simply acting on orders.

2) Everything the audience sees in this scene is only the way it plays out in Patrick’s mind, and in reality he is not hopelessly tied to the chair and he’s the one that is really the masked man killing the students and inspiring fear.

3) The poem is Patrick’s darker self’s vision of himself,  (Red John)  or even of the good side, Patrick. The poem is a partner to “The Lamb” and the poet sits in awe of how the same God that created the innocent little lamb could have created the sleek, lethal tiger. Which side of Patrick is the Tiger? Maybe not even Patrick himself knows. The dark side may see the good side as dangerously as the good side may see the bad. This kind of confusion helps explain the fearful obsession between Red John and Patrick Jane.

Is this theory any good? Well, there are a lot of things wrong with it.

First of all, it’s pretty brutal to cast Patrick Jane as secretly a deranged killer capable of viciously murdering his own wife and daughter, not to mention the long list of other victims.

Second of all, it’s near impossible to explain events that transpire simultaneously in which Patrick Jane is in the company of Teresa Lisbon or another CBI agent as Red John acts. Could these all be accomplices? Yes. Is is likely? Not in this author’s opinion.

Thirdly, people connected to Red John don’t seem to behave in a way that indicates that RJ is Patrick Jane while they are in his presence. Rebecca, Agent Bosco’s secretary inside the CBI in the second season, for example, has no emotional connection with Jane but apparently does with the unidentified man that poisons her.  The blind woman that was in love with “Roy” who is suspected to be Red John also seems to have no emotional connection with Jane.

Fourthly, the third season finale puts Jane physically in front of a man who has intimate knowledge of Red John’s crimes and provokes Jane into violent action.

Some fans have brought up some slight facts that could maybe possibly suggest a hint that Patrick Jane is Red John, however, the evidence against the case is much larger (in this author’s opinion) than any possible evidence presented in defense of this theory.


151 Comments on “Is Patrick Jane Red John”

  1. 1 Jessie C said at 6:43 pm on July 21st, 2011:

    It can’t be Patrick because in one episode (I forget which) two girls ask him to sit with them and he said no I’m married. Come on it just can’t be him, no way. And for him to have a split personailty something tromatic would have to happen to him when he was a child. If he ever did get one, it should have been AFTER he saw his wife and child murdered. I vote towards Partridge.

  2. 2 Jess said at 4:04 pm on September 25th, 2011:

    I was completely against the Red John is Jane theory when I first heard it, and indeed, it still suffers from the same plot problems that you outlined in your article, which cause me to remain skeptical.

    However, there are a number of incidents and comments, particularly in light of the first episode of the new series (when read in the light of the RJ is PJ) that do make the argument somewhat convincing:

    Tyger Tyger is – as Cho explains – about light and dark, about how there couldn’t be good without evil.

    Jane and John are opposite names used by the police to label unidentified people. Pink can apparently be seen as the female equivalent of the name Patrick (http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Patrick). So you have Pink Jane and Red John – some symmetry there arguably. Jane also orders lamb at the beginning of this episode – tenuous maybe, but also maybe a bit of subtle symbolism.

    In the latest episode, Jane says a) ‘inserting yourself into the middle of the investigation, that’s classic psychopath behavior’, b) ‘it’s usually the spouse, but that would be so boring’ and c) ‘the simplest answer is usually the right one’ (referring to ‘B’ most likely applying, because I admit Jane being Red John s by no means the ‘simplest’ answer in this case’.

    Also, take the meeting with ‘Red John’ from the last season finale. Consider RJ’s words are ‘mocking’ John. He asks ‘who am I, who are YOU?’. He says ‘maybe I’ll quit the murder game, I’ve got talents and resources, I could really help’. What if he is laying out the path that Jane actually took. Also, consider Jane’s constant referral to being ‘one step ahead’, but time and time again, it seems that neither RJ or PJ actually achieve the upper hand.

    Like I say, I am by no means convinced but I am more and more persuaded by the arguments and there seems to have been an increase in ‘tidbits’ of evidence to support it. It’s my belief that it is him, it’s not conscious (Dissociative identity disorder). If it’s not him, my money would be on Malcolm McDowell (his character rather than the actual actor, obviously). But I’d really be interested to hear of other opinions – in particular comments to tell me to stop being so stupid, because I would quite like to convinced otherwise.

  3. 3 Isis said at 12:17 am on October 20th, 2011:

    Hmm~ I seriously doubt it. Like others said, for him to have a split personality would have had to happen to him as a child…on the other hand, Jane DOES have a very quirky personality and a mysterious past which is only revealed in small parts of episodes (the one where he gets hit by a baseball and starts having mini flashbacks in particular.)
    And…Isn’t Patrick usually with Lisbon and/or the team when something happens that has to do with Red John? Anyway, THAT would…definitely be an odd and fascinating plot twist. Wonder how the others would deal with it if he were?

  4. 4 Aaron said at 4:51 am on November 5th, 2011:

    Jane is so NOT Red John. It’s not in the spirit of the show. There are weird parallels since they are supposed to be opposite in every way, but it ends there. His emotions are too real: the fear of Red John, the love for his wife, etc. Only a scenario where he is not self-aware. But is Jane THAT smart that he can do the amazing things Red John did, all while blacked out?

    Evidence that makes it really unlikely: 1) We see Red John talk to Jane, albeit in a mask. We know Red John uses accomplices, but you’re telling me Patrick told the accomplice to wear a mask so he could trick himself? Far too intricate. 2) Red John killed Renfrew in Mexico while Jane was still in California. Renfew, who knew Red John’s identity, supposedly, wrote on the wall in blood: “He is Mar.” Why not write “he is you” or “he is Jane?” 3) It doesn’t fit with Jane’s background. He was a sleazy tv psychic when Red John first started killing. He wasn’t psychologically broken yet. He hardly fits the profile.

  5. 5 Ben Miller said at 2:58 pm on November 5th, 2011:

    I have a strong case to prove that Red John is actually Patrick Jane.

    Ever heard of the poet William Blake? The first stanza of his poem “Tyger” was recited in the season finale of season 2 by Red John. William Blake wrote two famous sets of poems, the poems of “Innocence” and the poems of “Experience”. The “Tyger” was in the poems of “Experience”. The “Tyger” was also a sequel to an innocent poem called the “lamb”. I believe that Jane has an alter ego that is Red John. Jane represents the innocent lamb and his alter ego, Red John, represents the experienced “Tyger”. The lamb and tyger are opposites representing innocence and fierceness. Just like Patrick Jane and Red John. This would be a huge coincidence if it does not pan out to be true.

    Another symbol that Jane and Red John are the same person is their names. Jane is the feminine version of the name John. Most widely seen as “John Doe” and “Jane Doe”. This could help prove that Red John is an alternate personality of Patrick Jane.

    Also, when you search the meaning of the word “jane”, you will find that it is the name of a certain shade of pink. Pink is undeniably the feminine form of the color red. Yet another link that Jane and Red John are one.

    Here is a quick look at what I have shown you thus far. (PJ=Patrick Jane, RJ=Red John)

    PJ–Lamb–Innocent–Feminine–Pink

    RJ–Tyger–Experienced–Masculine–Red

    Those are clues I have found outside of the show itself. Now I will show some evidence that comes straight out of the show.

    In the episode “Blinking Red Light”, Jane finds out that Panzer is a serial killer because he wants to prove that he is smarter than everyone else and he wants to get close to the case. This is labeled as typical serial killer behavior. Well, isn’t that what Jane has being doing since the first episode of the series? He has tried to outsmart everyone and he even became a CBI consultant to get close to the case.

    It seems that all of the Red John murders have been one person at a time, except for the murder of Jane’s wife and daughter. Is there a reason for this? I say that Jane killed his own family while he was acting as Red John.

    In the end it is just another theory, but a theory I find pretty compelling. People do not want to believe that their beloved Patrick Jane is actually an evil serial killer, but when you face the facts you find it is very possible.

  6. 6 Loviathar said at 3:06 am on November 6th, 2011:

    Try watching every episode with the idea that Jane is Red John. Take S04E07 – Jane stares at the red light of the camera and then purposely goads Panzer into challenging Red John. This achieves a number of objectives for a Jane/Red John personality:
    1.) It enables Red John to take out Panzer where Jane won’t easily be able to.
    2.) It enables Jane to ‘prove’ Red John is still alive.

    Jane only really has a purpose in pursuing Red John, and Red John is always very close to Jane.

    I have come to believe this is in fact the truth, and re-watching past episodes only solidifies the theory for me. Think of how many time Jane speaks of how easy it would be to {insert something a serial killer might do here} if you know how. Intimating each time that he knows how. Think of the parallels between Jane and Panzer. Think of Panzer’s words to Jane in the ‘Kill Room’ – How can you live with such duplicity.

  7. 7 Rtn said at 9:45 pm on November 6th, 2011:

    this is just a guess and i know there havent been any straight facts to prove it, but could he have another brother and they where split at birth(none to ever speek about it) like dexter.
    that could fit all the marks with the names/poem and explain why redjohn is there in s2 finale(if its not janes mind cracking) and so on

  8. 8 MJ said at 1:27 pm on November 7th, 2011:

    Here’s the thing; the writers can do a ‘St Elsewhere’ type ending:
    Camera pans back to reveal Patrick Jane sitting in a cell, voice over reveals he is the killer Red John…turns out everything we’ve seen has been played out in his mind as a way to avoid acknowledging that he killed his own family. Do I hate it? Yes. Do I think it is sloppy? Yes. Have TV writers ever done sloppy, lazy things? You betcha.

  9. 9 sascha said at 9:30 pm on November 16th, 2011:

    I believe that some part of Jane does know that he is Red John and he trys to stop himself. This part brings up a situation in which Jane kills a man (not red John as we know now for sure). The normal way would be to send him in jail forever. … Does not happen. Now he creates a situation in which Red John is showing his face again – on a wall killing Panzer. Both Red John and Jane are to smart to make mistakes, but something inside him trys to stop himself.

  10. 10 Dash said at 3:06 am on November 18th, 2011:

    I feel sure that the writers are throwing out false clues to plant the seed that Jane is RJ. As someone else said, he immersed himself in the RJ case, he got visibly upset when Panzer knocked RJ on the TV show, after stating that Panzer got upset when his alter ego was insulted.

    I like to think that if Jane was RJ they would be more subtle in the clues. These just seem way too obvious and clumsy, but we’ll see in time

  11. 11 Dr Joe, NH said at 4:32 pm on November 18th, 2011:

    I just spent the last 2 hours writing to the site explaining why jane is red john so i’m not even going to get into that. I just wanted to say, for god’s sake stop falling back on the “Oh well in season two patrick comes face to face with red john”. Actually no, he comes face to face with someone who claimes to be red john. Saying you are somebody doesn’t make it true. For example, I am Santa Clause. See? It’s really not that difficult. It has been stated on the show that some people who work for red john have never actually made physical contact with him!! So who says that man who wore the mask wasn’t just doing what he had been ordered to do, and Jane just came to a) watch the imposters get killed and b) to make sure nobody would ever suspect he was Red John. There is no hard evidence to suggest that anyone who claims to have met Red John has ACTUALLY met Red John. Just watch the show with the perspective that jane is Red John. It’ll become pretty clear.

  12. 12 Marie said at 3:07 am on November 19th, 2011:

    I too believe that Patrick Jane is Red John. My daughter has been watching it from the beginning and kept telling me how gorgeous Simon Baker is. I started watching it with her a couple of years ago, but never really paid attention, until this summer. I started watching all the previous seasons with her and have to admit, I am a true fan now. I didn’t think about Patrick being Red John until the Panzer episode. I just thought to myself, “hmmm, maybe HE is Red John”? I’ve always felt that the smiley face on the wall drawn in blood resembled Patrick, with those droopy eyes (which by the way on Simon are very sexy). The next day I was on FB reading comments and one person made a slight comment that Patrick could be Red John. I mentioned it to my daughter and she said “I was thinking that last night” and I told her I had also thought the same. I agree with Loviathar (above comment), that now when I watch the show I just assume he’s Red John, and it all fits perfectly, as well as watching the old shows with the mindset that Patrick is Red John. The only problem is that we love Patrick Jane’s character so much as he is, that it would be so sad for him to be the monster. : ) (don’t know how to make droopy eyes).

  13. 13 evrim said at 8:43 pm on November 21st, 2011:

    I also believe that P.J. is R.J!

  14. 14 Anubia said at 10:40 pm on November 24th, 2011:

    PJ is RJ. Janes eyes are unusual they slant downwards just like the Red John symbol! Think about it!

  15. 15 Dd said at 6:38 pm on November 26th, 2011:

    What is Jane was schyzofren and those not knknow him self that he did all that, as if he hahad 2 personalities, hidden from himself ?

  16. 16 AM said at 10:23 am on November 29th, 2011:

    Patrick Jane is that real Red John, i have no doubts. In the first season finale, on the mountain house, have a book and a cup of tea. Jane even read books and like to much drink tea cup’s. That’s strong evidences of this and, also the blood’s face mark of Red John is the Jane’s face smiling. It’s very simple to me see this things.

  17. 17 MentalMentalistFan said at 7:35 pm on November 30th, 2011:

    So, I have a theory. Two actually.

    If you notice, in every close up of Patrick Jane his pupils are dilated. That is, as he himself says about other people he encounters, a sign of shock or hypnosis. This leads me to believe that Patrick may actually be under hypnosis and is not aware that he is Red John or that he works for Red John, one or the other.

    My second theory is that all the people on his team (Lisbon, Cho, Rigsby and Van Pelt) are hypnotized by him which would explain how some murders by Red John are committed while Patrick is with the team. If you’ve noticed, when a case involves Red John, Van Pelt is always left behind…
    Also, all of them are in love with Patrick, they look at him like he’s their mother or something like that, another sign of hypnosis.

    I love Patrick and I hate looking at him and thinking “you’re a cold blooded murder” but on the other hand, wouldn’t it just suck if he wasn’t Red John?

    The show is pretty clever, however, it might be way more interesting and intricate than we think.

  18. 18 Ravnika said at 8:47 pm on November 30th, 2011:

    If Patrick Jane isn’t Red John, then it has to be someone very close to him, possibly a relative (which would explain this whole “Tyger” and “Lamb” mentioned by Ben Miller). Thus far, we have only encountered two of his relatives by memories or contact: Jane’s father, and Jane’s brother-in-law.
    Now, I’m ruling out Jane’s brother-in-law because he just felt deeply and undeniably depressed about his sister’s death.
    On the other hand, Jane’s father was part of a circus in which Jane helped out when he was a kid, meaning that Jane most likely did not get any education and relied on his father. Meaning that he most likely taught Jane pretty much everything he knows today. After seeing what type of guy his father was (lying, con man, manipulative), Jane left the circus.
    So would “the Tyger” then represent Jane’s father? Angry at Jane for having given up on his ‘family’, wanting to teach him a lesson? And most of all watching Jane’s every move and mess with his mind? (again, this is just an idea thrown out there)

    The problem is, in this series, so many clues points to all sorts of different people (even ones you’ve met only once in the whole seasons). It wouldn’t be a surprise if every single one of the characters on the show were to be related with Red John or be accomplices somehow.

  19. 19 Fionna said at 11:30 pm on December 1st, 2011:

    I have thought for a while that Jane is Red John, with a split personality that he is unaware of. Perhaps caused by trauma in his childhood, or trauma /denial of the murder of his family. To explain the murders that occur while he is with the team, wouldn’t murder by a hypnotized accomplice be a good way to avoid detection?

  20. 20 Katy said at 4:14 am on December 3rd, 2011:

    Following on from the “Jane is the Lamb” analogy, he has soft blonde wool-like hair. Just sayin’.

  21. 21 Katy said at 4:28 am on December 3rd, 2011:

    I missed the episode where they met Red John’s blind “lady friend”. Did she and Patrick meet face to face and talk to each other? She would sense if Jane and John were the same person.

  22. 22 Aaron said at 3:35 pm on December 8th, 2011:

    Is it possible yes. But wouldn’t RJ try to make the evidence point back to PJ being crazy? Season 2 finale kind makes it obvious that he indeed is not RJ. Think about him being kidnapped. It actually shows it right? If he was RJ wouldn’t he just say that all that happend? The crazy split personality has been over done by movies. The writers of this series are way past some lame physcological thriller plot.

  23. 23 David Smith said at 11:56 pm on December 10th, 2011:

    Receently I have noticed the plot shifting and perhaps pointing in the direction of Jane being Red John. Most notably Season 4 Episode 4 “Ring Around The Rosie”.
    At the end of the episode, Wainwright is speaking to PJ and informs him that he has carried out a psychopathy test on Jane. He then states “you are a clinical psychopath”
    Jane replies “well , certainly explains a lot”.

    Now, either this is a clear clue that PJ really is RJ or it’s yet another clever “red herring”. I am inclined to suspect that it’s the latter. The plot thickens!

  24. 24 Ralph Spoilsport said at 12:39 am on December 14th, 2011:

    I consider it one of several possibilities that Jane is also John. The technical analysis of the stories so far are logical in many ways but the key to consider in this kind of program is that bad writing wins over logic. I like the series a lot but it still is extremely poorly done in many ways. Incredibly poor management by Lisbon and outrageous actions by Jane and the team that only get get a little finger wagging and then are forgotten in the next episode are just two examples. Writers could easily do much more and better character development of supporting cast members without detracting from the Jane show. “The Closer” is a good example of this done well. In the end, I suspect that the writers will be commanded to put a series of ridiculous twists in place and end it unsatisfactorily for many. Until then, I just enjoy it as a guilty pleasure instead of good TV. IT is also lots of fun to wonder about these things and posit them to my wife as we watch.

  25. 25 steve said at 3:44 am on December 15th, 2011:

    I had come to the conclusion that, while it would be a stupid, gimicky ending, that Jane might be Red John.
    However, I think the more realistic explanation is that the writers of the show started this supposition, and will subtly build on it, inserting dialogue that just might seem to point to that conclusion.
    That would still be gimicky, but it would also attract more viewers, especially to the series finale, and let the show wrap up in a feel good manner.

  26. 26 rtn said at 12:42 pm on December 16th, 2011:

    About the hypnotizing of the team or even people to kill for him is not an option since you cant hypnotize people to do things they have to do against their own will.
    Like killing a person then the hypnotized person should have a seed of this in his mind on beforehand

  27. 27 anonymous said at 7:51 am on December 18th, 2011:

    But, i remember this episode where jane met someone who knew red john. I don’t remember which episode (the one where jane was kidnapped) but this person would have acknowledge jane as red john but he didn’t. Therefore, jane can’t be red john unless this person lied that he knew red john personally.

    what do you think?

  28. 28 anonymous said at 7:55 am on December 18th, 2011:

    also remember the blind girl? Why couldn’t she recognise jane as red john? Surely she could have recognised his voice. She said she knew what kind of person red john was.

  29. 29 bry17may said at 2:54 am on December 19th, 2011:

    I want that Red John is a brother of jane or something like that, only think about this.

    Cried by the same peoples, in the same environment but with differentes way of thinks

  30. 30 aaron said at 4:54 am on December 20th, 2011:

    Perfect point about the blind girl! Kind of a theory killer. Just saying.

  31. 31 Lena said at 11:21 pm on December 22nd, 2011:

    I strongly believe that PJ is RJ! The person who created PJ’s character has based it in every single way on that of someone with narcissistic personality disorder, a disorder similar to a psychopath. I lived with one for years, studied the subject, and once you know one you recognise others (even ficticious ones!) because they are all clones of each other. Every single word, gesture, nuance, attitude, mannerism PJ displays is characteristic of this disorder. In this disorder, the person absoluely cannot accept anything wrong about themselves, so create split aspects of themselves that are completely unaware of each other. Like real people with the condition, he attracts people with his charm, charisma, genius, brilliance, wit and suaveness while they overlook his indifference to people’s feelings and his belief that the rules are for other ordinary mortals, not him. He seeks attention, acts dramatically, forms only superficial attachments while leading people on with a kind of sexual suggestiveness (simmering chemistry with Lisbon). I believe he killed his family, then went on the talk show with his provokative speech to make it look like he had incited RJ to teach him a lesson. Then joined the CBI in order to insert himself into the case, as psychopaths do.

  32. 32 epona said at 12:05 am on January 4th, 2012:

    Adding my two cents to this theory (which probably seems a tad mad but anyhoo) – I listened to the audio tape which compared the voice of the forensic guy in the pilot to that of RJ in youtube clip and what struck me wasn’t resemblence between the two – but between Patrick Jane and RJ. (which led me to this theory online).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rjXOkCxUUw

    If you listen carefully, especially to RJ section, there are certain words which lose their high pitch at the end of each sentence and sound very Jane like e.g. 1.09-11 (symmetry), and “Kyristina would want me to send her love” – I thought it sounded very similar to Jane’s diction, esp the line ” she’s very fond of you”.

    Any thoughts?

  33. 33 Matt said at 11:36 pm on January 7th, 2012:

    Every one seems to think that if P.J is R.J he’ll have some sort of multi personality disorder/fractured psyche? And that explains how he can do what he does and still sleep at night (metaphorically speaking, I seem to remember him saying he’s an insomniac?)

    What if he knows exactly what he’s doing, there is no childhood trauma he’s just a immoral psychopath and the 2 personalities are simply a part of his game!?

    Just an idea

  34. 34 Logic said at 5:46 am on January 9th, 2012:

    This theory is very, very flawed.
    1.) The blind girl would have recognized his voice.
    2.) The blind girl said Red John had been coming and going regularly, wouldn’t CBI have noticed?
    3.) Patrick is far away from the murder sites when the kills take place, unless he has an endless list of accomplices which can all perfectly draw the smiley he isn’t RJ.
    4.) RJ’s accomplice didn’t recognize him.
    5.) Kristina Frey-wouldn’t she have said something when she was being called upon????
    6.) His team would have found out by now, especially since he spends so much time around the office.

    This entire idea is a load of bogus, the writers place these clues to lead people on and get everyone intrested.

    Patrick Jane IS like Red John though, but people here aren’t getting the point of their comparison. They are a parallel, intelligence, charm, and wit; one using it for good one using it for evil. The contrast between Patrick and John is clear, but that doesn’t mean they’re the same person.

    Additionally, everyone who’s saying “Red John in season 2 finale is irrelevant” is sadly mistaken. If you’re claiming that his actual presence there isn’t evidence then how can you possibly support a load of theories based off a few lines the writers threw in for giggles.

    I seriously suggest people drop this theory, it’s very unfounded.

  35. 35 Swag said at 3:48 am on January 13th, 2012:

    Patrick and Red John both loved a women but Patrick married her so Red John turned into a jealouse, mad and evil human being by killing the wife and daughter and now stalks Patrick as he shows the world he is a better Mentalist than Patrick.

  36. 36 CLARISE said at 4:10 am on January 13th, 2012:

    I write for ABC and I can tell you that Red John is Patrick Jane. Patrick Jane is Red John.

  37. 37 hazel said at 8:00 pm on January 13th, 2012:

    people keep pointing to the blind girl as evidence that jane can`t be red john b/c she would recognize him. but think back, who told her he thought she had met red john? it was patrick himself. so, it’s possible he just said that to mislead.

  38. 38 Red Jane said at 9:49 pm on January 13th, 2012:

    Patrick Jane is Red John.
    He made the sacrifice of his wife and daughter to continue to accomplish his serial killer activities.
    He is the only one capable of identifying if it is a Red John’s act or not. If RJ is dead or not.
    There are no material proof of the physical existence of Red John. He knows every police movements. He destroyed proofs : the burnt guy in the CBI local ! He covered himself (kidnapping, threats…).
    He can not be suspected. He has an angel face (nice signature, a red smiling face…).
    He orchestrated his own rebirth.Work freely for CBI allows him to redeem himself and be informed about what the police knows about RJ crimes.
    Who benefits ? Patrick Jane…
    He may be a schizophrenic… Three seasons to know…

  39. 39 Jane said at 4:02 am on January 14th, 2012:

    Well the thing about the blind girl…sometimes if people have split personalities or something their voice changes almost as I they were in fact a totally different person…

  40. 40 Jane said at 4:09 am on January 14th, 2012:

    Plus the season 2 finale could have been inside of janes head the whole time and he could have killed those college kids….one especially weird thing is how red John can disappear so quickly as almost if he were never there….and the only people who have come forward who has ever been in red johns presence is patrick Jane and the blind girl…kinda sketch if you ask me…. But I do think it’s a little too obvious and the writers could possibly be trying to point us in the wrong direction….but I guess we won’t really know until the end….

  41. 41 Jane said at 4:24 am on January 14th, 2012:

    Also this deep hate for red john could be in fact his own self loathing for what he did to his family if he is infact red John….everyone has a dark side….some darker than others, and the darker it gets and the further you go, the more lost you get, and the harder it becomes to be saved.

    I could also be reading into it too much and he really is not red John and just wants that monster to pay for what he did, revenge is always sweeter than justice, because justice isn’t always fair….I mean come on if I were in Patrick Jane’s position and someone did that to my family….I don’t know if justice would be enough for me. In my opinion there is no closure in justice, only revenge. Knowing that there’s one less monster out there that can’t hurt anyone else or put their family through what other people’s have been through makes me feel a lot better than if they were in a tin box.

  42. 42 logan said at 10:42 am on January 16th, 2012:

    I don’t think Jane is Red John but I think Jane hypnotized his wife to marry her because he says she never liked the circus life conman acts and she wanted to take exit door from that life but after they married Jane was still a conman I think it makes sense that explains why he feels that much guilty about their death and hates himself that much

  43. 43 Jamesg1951 said at 5:26 pm on January 16th, 2012:

    I think Jane did kill Red John , but convinces ONLY LISBON that Red John is not dead so that he can continue to work with the team and bring justice to the evil villains. So Jane now kills only really bad guys using Red John as a cover story.
    He knows the police cannot and will not do the things he does like break into houses to get evidence and set up the bad guys and save people who feel they have to kill to get revenge like he did.

  44. 44 jamesg1951 said at 5:28 pm on January 16th, 2012:

    They should have a contest here and whoever gets it right first wins a big prize.

  45. 45 Libby4Z-Tune said at 12:37 pm on January 17th, 2012:

    Wow! Quite a lot of analysis here! Very creative people. Am sure productions team is enjoying reading your comments, and quite honored to be revered as high as this! How many of you believe that this theory is actually a way for the writers to create a highly surprising ending? All because we have discussed the various angle to John/Jane characters?? Think about it, this is so beneficial to them, to come up with an end that never was discussed??

  46. 46 byly said at 11:02 am on January 18th, 2012:

    Jane can be RJ , maybe he is a mad person , and when he saw RJ , it was his imagination , PJ like to hunt himself , that what I think , that why he killed his family to be in the spotlight . Everything is possible .
    if you seen all episodes , just think PJ is RJ and is possible to be .

  47. 47 arthurshade said at 12:04 pm on January 18th, 2012:

    I think we should all stop guessing, and enjoy the programme :)

  48. 48 bram said at 10:04 pm on January 19th, 2012:

    I also believe that Patrick is Red John.
    RJ knows everything about the CBI, about the police management etc. So it must be someone inside the CBI.
    Jane knows in a few seconds everything about every suspect, he scans them, like he was an baseball player, etc.
    If one of the crew members, like van Pelt or Rigsby would be RJ don’t you think that Patrick would have mentioned that?
    He also killed Panzer, the San joaquin killer.

    Also at the end of the episode 4, Wainwright is speaking to Patrick and informs him that he has carried out a psychopathy test on Jane.
    He then states “you are a clinical psychopath”

    Jane replies “well , certainly explains a lot”.

  49. 49 Red Herring said at 6:42 pm on January 21st, 2012:

    There are two interesting literary devices that could be useful here.

    In fiction, heroes work with or against different (Jungian) archetypes that appear as external forces or characters, but can be thought of as facets of ones personality or stages of development.

    The interesting one is the so-called “shadow”. The shadow stands for all the things that we don’t like about themselves, the things we regret and so forth. The shadow is typically the main villain, the antagonist.

    Red John is a shadow to our protagonist Patrick Jane. Regardless of Red John being Patrick Jane, we can safely say that Red John is obsessed with Patrick Jane, and could as well have created the name and “narrative” as a form of mockery and strange admiration.

    Their story probably began much earlier. Red John is to Patrick Jane as Prof. Moriarty is to Sherlock Holmes. He likes to play chess with his opponent and like in chess, he doesn’t just want to take the pawn, but checkmate him. This means utter destruction not just taking his life. Red John does the same with Patrick Jane. Note that the first Sherlock Holmes novel was called “A study in scarlet” (scarlet is a red color).

    The second device I want to mention is the Red Herring. Yes, RED (!) herring. The red herring is employed in any crime and detective fiction to distract the audience. As wikipedia puts it: “where the identity of a criminal is being sought, an innocent party may be purposefully cast in a guilty light by the author through the employment of deceptive clues, false emphasis, ‘loaded’ words or other descriptive tricks of the trade”.

    I believe therefore, that the symbols, poem and wordplay (red smiley face resembling Jane; Jane/John; Tyger/Lamb, Patrick the Saint etc.) are due to the playfulness and sadistic obsession of the Red John character.

    It could be that Jane has a split personality. But it could be that all the redness is just an elaborate Red Herring hidden in plain sight.

    To sum up. I think Red John was a serial killer or former colleague of Patrick. Like Moriarty who already was a mastermind criminal. For some reason, he is obsessed with Patrick Jane and due to that set up the symbols and killed Patrick’s family to get full attention. He wants to destroy Patrick Jane and perhaps even wants *Him* to believe he is Red John. For sure there are more than one Red Herrings at work.

  50. 50 Samm said at 7:10 pm on January 21st, 2012:

    Yea

  51. 51 GoGrace! said at 7:55 pm on January 21st, 2012:

    In my opinion PJ is RJ and it would definitly suck if it wasn’t…
    One thing that hasn’t been discussed is the role Van Pelt is playing in all of this. The series starts with Van Pelt’s first day at CBI. Why? For all I know she could have worked there before, right? So there has to be a certain meaning to it. While the other 3 members of the CBI unit might have there doubts about PJ’s methods of investigating Van Pelt has a deep mistrust against him and feels frightened and insecure in his presence. She even admits it in ‘Fugue in Red’ saying something like: “I don’t know how to act normal in Jane’s presence…” And the most recent episode makes it clear that she gets closer and closer to the truth. O’Laughlin advices her to “open her eyes fully” and that last scene where Grace asks PJ what to do with the necklace was so creepy it gave me shivers… There’s a bunch of additional clues like Van Pelt being the only one that turns her back on PJ’s couch, while everyone else’s desks are facing Jane. So far she didn’t want to look into reality, but soon enough she will… So what I’m trying to point out here is: Grace Van Pelt will be the one who catches RJ/PJ. I have no doubt.

  52. 52 Ben Miller said at 1:06 am on January 22nd, 2012:

    I’m back to discredit the blind lady idea. Think about how many minions Red John (Jane) has. He could easily have one of them pretend to be Red John for the blind lady.

  53. 53 GoGrace! said at 2:06 am on January 22nd, 2012:

    In addition to that blind lady thing: how much can you trust the senses of a woman who claims red john is a wonderful human being?

  54. 54 Ry Jay said at 7:42 pm on January 25th, 2012:

    I think you’re close. I think the creator(s) of this show watched a certain Christian Bale movie called ‘The Prestige’. I think they thought the movie could have been better (there is one glaring flaw in that movie) and created mentalist Patrick Jane for the tv show in an homage to Bale’s character in the movie. (I’d explain it but I don’t want to spoil the movie for anyone).

  55. 55 Name (required) said at 9:37 pm on January 30th, 2012:

    Red John actually called Patrick and spoke to him on phone on Season 1 episode 11, also the crimes Red John commits actually happen while Patrick is in the CBI with hundreds of witnesses… it simply can’t be him…

  56. 56 DR said at 11:14 pm on January 31st, 2012:

    There’s good reason to believe that Jane is indeed Red John. In one episode, his former psychiatrist is accused of murdering her ex-husband. (Season 1, ep 10: Red Brick and Ivy). In a flash, we see Jane in a mental institution with the Red John “smiley” on the wall of his cell, which he clearly painted himself. That episode revolves around a new procedure that can “re-balance” the moral compass of an individual. There is a hint there that Jane’s psychiatrist might have done this to him while he was in the mental institution.

    That one episode is what makes me believe that Jane is in fact Red John. I just can’t shake that conclusion from my mind.

  57. 57 Zen said at 3:10 am on February 3rd, 2012:

    After the episode where he helped the ailing man commit suicide, I got turned off the show. The man told Jane he heard that he was a guy who could help people like this. Does this mean he is known in some circles to be capable of killing. After that episode, I still watch the show if nothing else is on, but I don’t like Jane at all.

  58. 58 Chris Elphick said at 10:00 pm on February 3rd, 2012:

    I think no one, aside from the shows writers, will ever know this. However, we can speculate. And speculation in this instance is fun.

    The first question, that I think we can answer with a little more accuracy – and requires an answer, is “Who isn’t Red John?”

    You could perhaps go through every member of the cast and individually suggest why they dont quite fit the bill. But there is one candidate that really needs assessment here right from the off set – Patrick Jane himself. For the record, I don’t think that Jane is Red John.

    The suggestion that Red John is actually some creation of Jane’s isn’t mine. It is something that is recieving quite a lot of attention on different chat forums, like YouTube and http://www.redjohn.com. Although this is interesting I think that this is too far out a theory to hold any water in the long run. There are a number of examples that put John and Jane in different locations at exactly the same time, or one of Red John’s moles/friends/helpers is speaking to Jane about Red John.

    1) Re watch the series finale of season 1. There are a selection of instances where the time lines simply dont fit together. For example, I’m assuming that the victim found in the park at the start of the episode – who has her toe nails painted with her blood – was killed by Red John. There is no indication that Patrick was involved in this at all. He was very shocked and there was no sign that he had recently carried out a murder.

    2) In the episode “Red John’s Friends” – Patrick and the team go into the hotel room where the hooker and the man recently out of prison are Murdered. The cell phone rings (presumably this is Red John) both Patrick and Lisbon can hear this. Here is a link to the scene – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED9ngcO4cz4

    There are many other examples that you could find from almost any episode where Red John is featured. People who are advocates of the “Jane is John” theory are likely to suggest that, Fight Club style – or Dexter seeing Harry style – that these are all figments of Janes damaged mind. I do agree this is a potential idea – and this would satisfy a number of issues. For example, Graig was Red Johns mole. But was Craig being manipulated by Red John or the man that Jane actually shot in the food hall? I’m of the opinion that there could be a clue in the voice he used when talking to Lisbon. This was similar to the voice used by the masked man who rescued Jane at the end of season 2. However, when the coversation ends he reverts to his regular voice when speaking to Jane. I’m suggesting that Graig had previously had some sort of contact with the ‘real’ Red John, and this conversation was staged, perhaps to get Janes attention – but for the purposes of this conversation I want to assert that the ‘real’ Red John was the masked man at the end of season 2 and that Graig had previosuly been in contact with him. I would suggest that this character is likely to be the same one that the mole from ‘His Red Right Hand’ spoke to.

    But this raises another point – when Rebekah is poisoned, who does this? Red John himself? Or a mole inside the CBI? She said earlier in the episode that she loves Red John – and she certianly appears to be fond of the man who killed her. But is this just another version of the man who Patrick killed? It could be argued that none of the ‘versions’ we have seen of Red John are actually him, but people that work for him. This argument becomes circular and eventually becomes a little too thin. For example, in the most recent episode we do see a man who is suggested to be Red John – he is drinking tea (just like Patrick) along with the blind lady. The same argument could apply – this is just another of Red’s friends. And I agree this could be the case, but it simply lacks depth and imagination.

    So what do I think? Well I want to take a slightly different slant on this and I want to remind ourselves of another aspect of the show – that of Hypnosis and NLP.

    For the most part, whenever Red is present we hear the classical music theme, or see the face. Sometimes they happen at the same time, and sometimes just one happens. In a sense us a viewers are being anchored to this. We assossciate this with Red. I personally get scarred or upset when I see/hear them. And I think there is likely to be a clue here.

    I think that there is a time when we have seen Red – other than when drinking tea in the last episode. He was present at the funeral of the man than Patrick Framed as the sam whatkin killer. When jane and lisbon are heading to their truck the camera panns out and you see a car drive past, the NLP clue here is the sound we hear when this happens. I can only describe this is a high pitch scream. I’m sure that this had happened throughout the 4 seasons – but I only noiticed it recently. I think this may be a clue to who is Red John. Find out who is in the car – you got Red John. This is the only original thing I can suggest. The other ideas are good but they are too cliche – this truely breaks the fourth wall and fits in very nicely with the meta narrative of the program.

  59. 59 Natalie said at 12:09 am on February 4th, 2012:

    I’m fascinated that I’ve across all these theories, after thinking to myself last night after watching the show (yes, I’m hooked too) hmmm “is Jane Red John?” and put that in my google search only to find 100′s of fans think the same. I can’t say what tipped me off exactly – but it was a gut feeling due to his expressions, and certain ‘coincidences’ that seem to show he is hiding something/controlling something (eg. saying one thing to the other CBI investigator who’s still keeping the RJ file open, and another thing to Lisbon, about why he went the morgue to prove that guy was or wasn’t Red John. And then the morgue guy is killed in the blind woman’s house – to make a point to not ‘screw’ with him – to the CBI woman? I don’t know).

    I think there is something to all the symbolic messages people have alluded to – good stuff.

    And to the fact he can hypnotise people while he goes and writes a note, then they snap out of it and he carries on as if no time has passed…..who’s to say he doesn’t do that when killing someone. (I agree in theory with what someone else said that the person hypnotised can’t kill against their free will; so i think it would only be used if he does the killing).

    Another interesting theory out there is the one about him actually ‘living’ this fake life in his mental state in a mental institution – a big false sense of reality that he’s solving the murder of his wife+daughter after either he killed or did find them dead. Another reason to call the show the ‘mentalist’.

    I love his character and love how the other actors interrelate, and how they keep you coming back to ‘solve’ a mystery each episode, while having this over-arching theme throughout. Very smart TV, yet entertaining and perfect for my after work day :)

  60. 60 Glen Ledger said at 1:50 am on February 4th, 2012:

    Season 4 ep. 13 – at the end, Red John was drinking tea while the blind lady was playing the piano. Who else likes to drink tea – Jane!!

  61. 61 LT Smith said at 9:47 am on February 10th, 2012:

    could be that PJ is working for red john? Maybe Patrick was manipulated by red john while he was in the metal facility. For sure he is a good mentalist, but Red John always seems to be one step ahead… At this point is imposible to be completely sure about anything about who is red john, and that’s certainly a good thing, because when we watch the finale of finales, we can watch all the episodes again, like we’re watching the fight club for a second time. By the way, if anybody hasn’t watch that movie, please, do it, it won’t disappoint you

  62. 62 PJ is not RJ said at 6:36 am on February 11th, 2012:

    I think Red John is Patrick Jane’s father.

  63. 63 LMU said at 1:52 am on February 18th, 2012:

    at the end of S04E07.. Patrick knows Red John will kill Panzer, so why isn’t he following Panzer to catch Red John? :)

  64. 64 JoEMZZZ said at 5:40 pm on February 25th, 2012:

    I think Patrick is not red john.. I think red john may somewhat be an important person in patrick’s past. Someone like a mentor when it comes to conning people. Well of course patrick defied and disrespected red john that’s why he taught him a lesson. Like teaching a student that he will not be as good as his master. All of our speculations lies on the writers but still with all the facts hanging each and every episode. I don’t believe that Jane is red john

  65. 65 Sylv said at 9:23 pm on February 26th, 2012:

    LMU,

    this is exactly why I now join the PJ is RJ group.

    for someone desesperate to kill red john, he missed an opportunity way too big too be a mistake. Pj was litteraly waiting the call to announce the death of panzer.

    Pj spend most of the episodes setting up people and send his team to follow him and catch them in the act.

    To me, this episode gives everything away .
    Either he is red john or he doesn’t want to catch red john.

  66. 66 Sylv said at 9:27 pm on February 26th, 2012:

    Thansk GoGrace, I find your analysis impressive. I did not see that

  67. 67 Rinaldo Julious McEwan said at 11:04 pm on March 3rd, 2012:

    You all will be amazed with the end episode it will be as a hour and half special.
    Always think outside the box as there are many clues it the episodes and some of you are on the right track.

  68. 68 Santiago said at 12:44 pm on March 4th, 2012:

    Is Patrick!! In the episode with the blind, red john show drinking tea, as he in all chapters.
    If not he should be someone who was in all the chapters, and they are many.

  69. 69 R3d J0#N said at 4:24 pm on March 4th, 2012:

    I dont think Patrick Jane could be Red John. Im sure the creators of this show are hearing all these unreasonable theories and are wondering, “Why would anyone think Jane was Red John?!” Jane couldnt possibly kill his own family and act like he was traumatized so they wouldnt pit the case on him. besides, Jane was on an interview show during the death of his wife and child. He may be mysterious as to his intentions , like saying he knew Panzer was going to be killed by Red John but didnt do anything to catch the murder, maybe he didnt want to catch him, or maybe he was too scared to find the killer of his family. there are thousands of theories on him, because he still seems to be a mystery. But we know enough to say JANE IS NOT RED JOHN. of course, we wont know the complete truth until the creators decide the next course of the series. They could have Red John kill Jane, or anyone he’s ever cared about, or they could have Jane kill Red John and be locked up forever, feeling better about it but also feeling the guilt of his family forever eat away his mind. Those would be terrible endings but It’s all up to the creators.

  70. 70 anon27 said at 6:06 pm on March 5th, 2012:

    I think its more like The Fight Club than like The Prestige. PJ might have split personality and have con over time a lot of followers who help him as RJ.
    I feel the personalities are merging somehow on S4.

  71. 71 Kara said at 12:42 am on March 9th, 2012:

    I realise there are a few issues with the theory that it has been Jane all along, but at this point I think I would be disappointed if it was anyone else. This is mainly because in order for the revelation of RJ’s identity to be a brilliant moment for the series, and for fiction, he will likely need to be a main character.

    If my theory/hope is correct, then Lisbon isn’t RJ, but rather she’s the real protagonist of the show. Her and Jane tend to be the central characters so if it did turn out that Jane was Red John, I would expect her to be pushed front and centre as the ‘good guy’ in the end which would be ok, because I think she’s one of the less annoying characters. If she herself were RJ the parallel would still be there, but with Jane the good guy and her the antagonist. This would be interesting but I don’t think it’s likely. She’s been a little bit too humanised as a character, and lacks the obvious personality cues that make Jane such a good choice for RJ.

    For me Cho’s character lacks the intricacy it would need to fit my profile. One of the most noticeable features of his personality is that he’s stoic and often seems disinterested. I would expect RJ, as a psychopath, to have the effortless superficial charm that Jane regularly shows.

    Rigsby similarly lacks the intricacy of character that I am looking for in RJ. He comes across as being very transparent, and even a little gormless at times. While it would be a very surprising plot twist if this
    was where the writers were heading it would also be, for lack of a better word, really weird.

    I’ve heard it argued that Grace has to be RJ just because she has red hair. That would be a tragic let down to everyone who has been at all invested in the show, so just no. Thatisall.

    Someone who was suggested to be me but who I haven’t really given much thought yet is Wainwright. He seems likely among the characters within CBI, but you’ve got to hope it’s someone a bit more, or a bit less, obvious? I don’t know how you guys feel, but it wouldn’t be earth-shattering for me if he turned out to be RJ. I imagine it would go something along the lines of: ‘Oh, ok then. Meh.’

    Which leads me on to my next point: how will we feel if it’s a completely new character, or one that we’ve only seen once or twice? Until the S3 finale I would have said it was a terrible idea, but that episode was actually very climactic and powerful in the end. I would have been able to sleep at night if the show ended there, with Jane having killed RJ and taken his revenge. Problem being, now that angle has been done, how can they introduce a totally new RJ all over again in such a way that it’s completely different to
    last time but still brilliant? Would be quite difficult, I fear.

    For all of the above reasons, I would love for Patrick to turn out to be Red John. I wouldn’t even mind which route they took with explaining this. It would be equally fascinating if he turned out to have been masterminding the whole thing while parading as Patrick Jane, or was discovered to have split personality and be unaware of what he’s been doing. As of yet there doesn’t seem to be any proof that he isn’t RJ that can’t be explained away with an alternate interpretation or a clever plot twist, so I for one am going to keep my fingers crossed.

    Kara

  72. 72 Luixander said at 5:56 am on March 9th, 2012:

    actually, theres a probability the series never did focus on the fact janes wife and daughter were actually his wife and daughter. that he killed them would very well be logical , that way hes got an excuse to offer his service as a consultant for cbi. using his ” vengance” as an excuse to be inside cbi and know their every move on the Red john case. on a few episodes back they’ve made emphasis on the fact jane has tendencies to multiple personalities. take for example that one episode where jane sees a man in the streets and finds him suspecious. the new cbi boss at the end of the episode mentions the reasons why the personality test they tried before on the suspect of a murder didnt work. but mentioned that jane has tendencies being a ” serial killer” .

    in todays episode the fbi thinks jane is working with red john.

    but then again, on the panzer episode, jane clearly uses panzer as bait, making him insult red john in public by saying he was ” better” ( which is something red john hated) , motivating red john to kill agian. this would prove to jane his theory of red john no being dead to be true

  73. 73 Sylv said at 10:24 pm on March 9th, 2012:

    agree until S4, PJ did not realise he is fighting against himself.

    If S4 is the merging, S5 will be the final season

  74. 74 Ricky said at 2:43 am on March 10th, 2012:

    Jane is not John…John is Jane

  75. 75 Mario said at 8:56 am on March 17th, 2012:

    the problems he had as a kid won’t turn him into a murder
    there’s a different between kid’s self aggresion and commiting murder
    kid’s self aggresion is very passive

  76. 76 Mario said at 9:01 am on March 17th, 2012:

    And And Jane can’t be red john becaue remember the episode where that assistant of agiant brasco or somethin
    the one that shot the whole team
    she was poisned while officers were takin her to the cell
    and while she was walkin she looked ( her neck muscles moved, she laughed her eyes pupilled up ( means she someone she recognize and trully sherish so it must be red john so jane is not Red john

  77. 77 Jon said at 2:08 am on March 22nd, 2012:

    In the scene where Jane comes face-to-face with Red John in the mask, if you listen closely to the voice, the pitch is changed, but the nuances are quite similar to Jane’s, down to the way his voice cracks on certain words.

    A lot of the arguments for him not being Red John can be explained away by the fact that Jane is both a masterful hypnotist and reader of people. He would be able to easily identify those who are not only susceptible to hypnosis but already possess the willingness to carry out the kinds of acts he desires.

  78. 78 dimitri said at 12:20 am on March 31st, 2012:

    There is a scene in the pilot episode where PJ is writing on his diary..Pause it an you will see the phrases ”it was you” ”you killed them” and a two ways diagram with the words ”I ‘m” in one side and ”Re” on the other.

  79. 79 Fraud said at 1:35 pm on April 6th, 2012:

    Hiya fellas
    the thought of Patrick Jane being Red John is intriguing but the thing is, the guy is so shocked and traumatized that has quit his life to find Red John so the only possible explanation is for Patrick to have multiple personality disorder.
    the hypnosis theory is wrong cause hypnosis works on weak minds. we all know that mind is everything but weak!
    and even the multiple personality disorder can’t it because having that disorder you’ll have no memories of acts done by the other personality. So basically you won’t even know you have the disorder, not to mention the issue of manipulating a Patrick Jane!
    So there’s no way guys!!!

  80. 80 Game on! said at 8:23 pm on April 14th, 2012:

    I strongly disbelieve that Jane is John. Yes, their names and minds are alike but yet they are different. I reminds me a movie with Kenau Reewes (I am sorry if I misspelled it) – anyways the main subject was a criminal, a serial killer, who played with the policeman. He wanted that this and only this policeman would deal with his cases, the killer even sent him clues and pictures about the next murder. Well, back to the mentalist. Jane being John would be too damn obvious. Jane=John, smart intellectual minds, one evil and one good, for me it would be so much disappointing. I find them be very similar. Jane loves games and so do John. But John hates copycats, frauds and bogus, he hates being called more than he is – an evil genius and Jane, he was everything John hates. And yes, maybe I do not want Jane to be the killer because I find him adorable and lovely but I would be so disappointed if it was him. I have grew dearly fond of him as a character he is. All I see that if Jane would be John he would have killed Erica Flynn a woman who had the same (I-can-see-people-through-and-make-them-do-what-I-want) qualities as Jane because they kissed in another episode. All in all, I just do not want him to be Red John.
    But I do must say I love the creators of this series – it is brilliant. All the symbols and things. Every episode has a pink to red color names (such as crimson or rose and etc.) and how it plays with your mind, the name game RJ and PJ I just love it. Yes, through writing this it came to my mind a lot that he could be the killer but still. I love him too much to admit it or think about it. :)

  81. 81 Game on! said at 8:25 pm on April 14th, 2012:

    I am sorry. In the line 8 I meant being calles less than he is (instead of more)

  82. 82 Game on! said at 8:32 pm on April 14th, 2012:

    To Dimitri: of course he wrote in his diary that he killed them, in a way. It was his fault that they were killed, he played with a killer and lost, he was arrogant and John punished him for that. And Jane feels guilty.

  83. 83 Game on! said at 8:57 pm on April 14th, 2012:

    Just a theory that popped in my mind right now. Since Jane is a man with a female name than John should be a female with a mans name. Of course now there is a problem with the blind woman a lover of John. But what if she has never really had any contact with the real John, maybe John sent a accomplice to stir the mud in the lake so he would not be caught. Who would it be ? I think Erica has Red Johns qualities – smart, knows how to make people do what she wants and she has the similar kind-of-loving attitude towards him but yet she is playing with him and she did kill her husband. But that idea is sadly weakened by the fact that we did not see her until 3 th season. So it can be someone else (still a female) but no one fits the profile. I do not know just an idea that intrigued me.

  84. 84 Xanthe said at 10:45 pm on April 14th, 2012:

    After reading ideas about how Red John is in fact Patrick Jane, i have realized how convincing they are; i disagree with them. This may be purely due to the fact i don’t want to admit that Jane is this Evil killer, however I just think that the writers would of allowed the viewers to have witnessed Jane having some sort of turn into his supposed split personality.
    My theory:
    I believe that Jane knows of Red John’s identity; he has not tied the two together.
    In the episode ‘Throwing Fire’ we learn of his past and his Father- His father is a ‘showman’, like Red John, (Patrick describes this in S1E1, whilst Red John is being framed.) Further, in an episode (I do not remember which one,) a line is quoted- “fear thy fearful symmetry”- this could suggest that Red John and Jane are in fact very similar, which is pointed out by numerous accomplices. It could also relate to the famous saying “Father like son” ; it could be there to remind Jane that he is in fact a product of his Father and he can not escape his past or what he is. Maybe his Father killed Jane’s wife and Daughter out of spite.
    Leading on to my next point, Jane refers to his daughter as ‘his child’ as Red John in the letter on the door. Maybe this is in fact a trait that Jane picked up whilst being under his care. Further, the letter was not hand written ; this could suggest that Red John was escaping forensics however, it could suggest that Jane would recognize the writing- suggesting a closeness.
    However, Red John could just be Jane’s Moriarty ; maybe we have not yet met him.

  85. 85 james dean said at 10:54 am on April 22nd, 2012:

    i think that jane may be red john now,but was’nt the red john who killed his wife and child,i think that red john killed janes peeps.and jane killed red john and thus he became red john himself as he faced outter aloneness,thats a big down fall for smart people once they brake they brake hard but i would hate to see jane be john cuz i love that guy lol and wasnt it just bad ass how he just offed the guy that said his girl smelled of strawberrys & cream then the OG just sat down to finsh his tea hell that was kool and cho or joe whatever lol cho hooks up with a hooker lol i love this show

  86. 86 ptah said at 5:09 pm on May 13th, 2012:

    The blind girl could have been dating one of Red John’s disciples.
    As much as I would like to think RJ = PJ, I think it would be too obvious and it has been over done in movies like Identity (and in a way… the matrix)
    What I know is:
    - we have already seen him (or her)
    - lisbon, cho, rigsby and van pelt cannot all be such numb skulls that jane ALWAYS saves the day.

  87. 87 EB said at 3:41 pm on May 16th, 2012:

    I think Red John is the psychic, Kristina Frye, the psychic who disappeared. Although, I am suspicious of every tall, flame-haired female who has ever appeared on the show.

  88. 88 Monte Conte said at 12:05 am on May 22nd, 2012:

    Jane fits the profile of a secondary psychopath, initially made that way by trauma, accident, and so on. They hint at it in the show. But he changed. How do we know? He shows genuine empathy on the show.

    Jane solves so many cases because he knows how psychopaths operate, he was one. Albeit a con man, one type of psychopath stereotype. In episode 424 RJ wanted to re-imprint Jane. We’re missing some historical information between RJ and TJ.

    The professional psychopaths stereotype often found in politics, religion or companies you can also tag as a charismatic cult leaders. That would provide opportunity to make secondary psychopaths and recruit other genetic wackjobs. This was how RJ got his followers and the only one on the show with that wherewithal was Malcolm McDowell as Bret Stiles. In addition, he ran a psychological NLP-type cult. And remember in one episode he had a mole in the police department.

    Like Dexter, they show us many types of psychopathic stereotypes. Unlike Dexter, the writers use these characters to provide many red herrings.

  89. 89 Adrian G said at 6:04 pm on May 27th, 2012:

    good point, Jessie C. that’s why, me too I don’t think Patrick is RJ

  90. 90 Harri said at 6:54 pm on May 28th, 2012:

    I do think it would be the perfect ending to the show and I can believe it would happen (eventually when the show ends…? The question is how long will they drag it out for? I love the mentalist but am desperate to know who red john is!). They’ve made Jane so likeable that the natural reaction is to say that he can’t be this killer, and before reading these posts I would have said he couldn’t be red john. But I have become convinced that there are too many coincidences to say otherwise.
    I think it would be an amazing ending (eventually), and after all the shows is essentially all about Jane messing with people’s minds…

  91. 91 Nix said at 8:58 pm on May 28th, 2012:

    PJ is RJ. When PJ is in the limmo in the season 4 finale and you hear RJ’s voice, it sounded so similar to PJ, even the very “posh” pronounciation of words/sentences e.g: “as you wish”. Listen to how PJ speaks and then listen to the voice of RJ….I’m convinced!

  92. 92 susan said at 3:26 am on June 1st, 2012:

    I just watched the may 31st eps. Pj is Rj he’s got to be. In the final part of the episode, Panzer taunts Rj buy calling him stupid for letting Jane kill him. Called him lazy and sloppy. Jane goes quiet and then complement Panzer on how well he did in the interview. In the last few moments Jane receives a call and Panzer is dead with the RJ symbol above him. It’s as if Jane was waiting for the call, he was not surprised. (to an earlier comment) Also remember he can hypnotize people so some might not remember an emotional attachment to him

  93. 93 susan said at 3:32 am on June 1st, 2012:

    What if RJ was Jane’s sibling an evil twin so to speak? Being similar in manner?

  94. 94 G G said at 4:45 am on June 1st, 2012:

    I just saw the episode with Panzer tnight. That sealed it for me. Jane fails to catch Panzer in his way, he’s frustrated. He zones out looking at the red light. Then stares at Panzer. He shakes out of it (or Rj composes himself).
    (I’m paraphrasing)
    panzer “I don’t hink San Juauin killer will be quite as easy to KILL as RJ”
    P/J “ur very much mistaken”
    (that’s a death threat)
    and circumstantial evidence asde, unless RJ is always close to PJ, how could he catch a flight after the 10 o clock news in time To kill Panzer and get away that evening?
    Btw, where was Patrick when he got that plone call?

  95. 95 Jane said at 4:14 am on June 10th, 2012:

    Am I the only one sincerely hoping that Patrick Jane is not Red John? Instead of seeing him revealed as Red John one day wouldn’t you be much more satisfied seeing Jane finally put an end to Red John? I mean, it would be almost cruel to have Patrick revealed as Red John and I think (from watching the show obsessively) we all know our lesson about serial killers and trusting in the wrong people. I don’t need a lesson on falsely trusting someone as entertaining as Patrick Jane.

  96. 96 gb said at 6:10 pm on June 11th, 2012:

    Watch season 4 finale. The voice of Red john is Patrick JANe’s voice. It is basically Jane holding his nose and trying to sound like a girl it seems Haha but its a million percent janes voice which means he is Red John and he pre recorded it. I had many friends listen to it who watch the show and although it took some a couple listens, we all agreed red johns voice was Patrick Jane. Red John can brainwash people. Which would explain how people like Loreli ..the blind woman…and others don’t realize they are in front of red john when Jane is around. I believe van pelt is one of his followers too. Besides look at the book Jane is reading in the garage while the team is preparing to leave for the desert. It’s Carl Jung’s book Modern Man in Search of a Soul. Which has sections in the book that basically speak about psychology and what people do when they aren’t consciously aware of it. Either Jane is red john or it’s his twin. Let’s not forget the blinking red light when he talks to panzer and when he is in the limo in the season 4 finale..there is a red light on the dashboard. That is not a coincidence. Jane is RJ. If I end up being wrong then I will be happy to be surprised when I find out its someone different. I have thought it was Jane since day one, only because I was writing a detective story about a cop who didn’t realize he was chasing a serial killer who happend to be himself. I am not sure how they will explain it but my guess is we will see that janes wife and kid prob had left him already or something and it made him crazy, he killed em, and then his psyche decided to manifest a good side to try and

  97. 97 Sara said at 1:54 am on June 23rd, 2012:

    If Jane was red john, the series would end and fans would be angry. Given that the director said that red john will be revealed in 2 seasons, I doubt they would make jane red john, because then it would be over and jane couldn’t go back to the cbi; the show wouldn’t go on.

  98. 98 rj said at 8:11 am on July 15th, 2012:

    like lambs to the slaughter, i hear you, i see you, but you need to listen more closely and open your eyes. Patrick and yourselves will soon see the bigger scheme of things, that i am his friend and you are the pawns of my little game. it will soon all be over.

  99. 99 Ziad said at 9:13 pm on July 17th, 2012:

    People have written paragraphs and paragraphs about their thoughts, so I’ll keep this brief. Patrick Jane IS NOT RED JOHN. It’s a good theory BUT he has ALIBIS for multiple of the Red John killings. Simple as that. Plus he’s mentally healthy, apart from being a clinical psychopath. Nothing about split personalities or any of those disorders. Still an interesting theory. But all the people that know Red John personally knew Jane wasn’t him..

  100. 100 Ziad said at 9:15 pm on July 17th, 2012:

    The blind woman knew Red John, she knew how he looked by touching his face, and she touched Jane’s.. If it was him she would have said so, plus Patrick Jane has alibis for multiple of Red John’s murders.

  101. 101 dan said at 7:03 am on July 21st, 2012:

    This theory has almost zero credibility as it relies solely on pj and rj’s similar psychopathic traits. That and a split personality disorder and/or hypnosis. Besides, dies no one remeber that red john was watching when dumar almost shot patrick

  102. 102 Unspoken said at 9:46 am on July 30th, 2012:

    Think simple, guys. Most of life’s complex quest boil down to simplicity. There within the complex lies simplicity. You will see yet not see. Hear yet not hear. Let simplicity grow, till it gets elegant

  103. 103 Gary said at 3:01 am on August 6th, 2012:

    I hope Jane is not Red John. My fear is that the people running the show may either have planned for this, or toyed with the idea as a means of generating interest. I’m honestly so tired of serial killers and being jerked around by storytellers that I find myself shying away from the Red John storyline when it pops up.

    If I had to prove that Jane is not Red John I would say that the well-established relationship between the blind woman and
    Red John rules Jane out. There’s no way a blind person would not know the voice of someone that they had an intimate relationship with, and Jane has talked to her multiple times.

    Which means if they really do try to go down that road in the show, I’ll both hate them and think they’re idiots.

  104. 104 Mike said at 10:10 pm on August 6th, 2012:

    Red John is a genius with an ability to manipulate and hypnotise all sorts of people, from psychics to FBI/ CBI chiefs.
    Patrick Jane is a genius with an ability to manipulate and hypnotise all sorts of people, from pyschics to FBI/ CBI chiefs.

    Red John had killed 8 people by the time Patrick’s family was killed. It was five years after the family killings that Jane joined CBI. This rules out ALL other suspects in CBI.
    Patrick was arguing with his wife about his lying lifestyle. He wanted to carry on even though she knew he was a fraud. He came to hate his wife. We know Patrick fought his Dad hard over the moral issues of his “work”. In the end he cracked and became two people – symmetry.

    It was five yars after his wife’s death that Jane joined CBI. In that time he underwent intensive psychotherapy lasting two years. Remember Red John was killing people way before Jane’s wife was killed…

    Red John is Patrick Jane! …… unless it’s his Dad!

  105. 105 raven2328 said at 12:42 am on August 16th, 2012:

    I have my thoughts that patrick is red john. watch the episode, i cant remember the name. ITs the one where red jonh kills a girl and has the face in the sky using a sky writing plane. They then found out that is has a twin sister who is missing. The cop is the one who kidnapped her and is holding in a basement. in the living room when jane and the cop enter there are to computer. and a cup of undrank tea sitting on the table. they so the cup 3 differnet times. who drinks tea all the time jane

  106. 106 Leander said at 5:25 pm on August 22nd, 2012:

    I just wanted to put in my two cents. I’m only half-way through Season Four, but I wanted to say that this episode (Always Bet on Red) is what finally convinced me that Patrick Jane is Red John. I want to clarify that I do not believe he was Red John for the entire time or show, but I think it is probable that he turns in to Red John after shooting the real Red John. I do think he murdered Panzer.I realize the rest of the episodes go differently, but either Patrick is Red John, or he takes on the persona of Red John once in awhile to get away with murder. That’s my take on it. I don’t think he could have been Red John before Season Four – after watching all of S1-S3, I just don’t think it’s possible. But, he is unhinged in season four, enough so that it’s either a split personality, or he’s using the Red John persona willingly.

  107. 107 Andre101 said at 5:15 pm on September 5th, 2012:

    I believe that the CBI and all the co-workers are in an institution. A secret mental institution in which Patrick Jane has some sort of multiple personality disorder and this is a program for him to “Kill off” his alter egos. Dont get me wrong , sure he solves cases but are all the cases in some way related to his past. I believe he is RJ and the final episode to air ever will include some sort of zoom out shot showing the facility. (Like some sort of area 51 stuff) All the characters have some sort of back round with mental issues and they are dealing with it all by a secret program that places Jane and others to confront some sort of past issue. Every time PJ kills off a “Major” killer, he is killing one of his personalities. Season 4 episodes 10-13 have so many clues saying “Oh its nice to see Patrick again” as if they last met when he was “someone else” . Look at Rigsby . I mean when Jane calls the “leader” of the CBI a baby and it hits him hard. look at him he looks like hes 23 years old.

    I have 2 Major theories.
    1. the CBI is part of a program that uses mental patients to help come back to reality by creating homicides and such that all were set up by a think tank and PJ is being observed and in a way being treated to kill off his alter egos

    2. The same as above but mix in real crimes and its not a secret asylum but defiantly a way to help Jane fight through his past and multiple personalities.

    He may not be Red Jon. But there sure as hell is something crazy going on with the whole CBI thing and all the cast having some sort of past that brought them there.

    and WTF is up with Rigsby and his lover/not wife/wife. I mean he called Cho in season 4 and he answered saying hello and rigs said whats up, chos like “i dunno you called me” then rigsby answered “oh yeah”

    Im just spitting theory. Would be cool if it was all some sort of treatment program for the mentally insane. I leave that up to you. When everything is revealed i guarantee that whatever you were thinking that would be the “end kicker”, we’re probably all going to be wrong.

  108. 108 ghost said at 11:32 pm on September 6th, 2012:

    the truth is they are going to use this theory for the finally and frame jane then find the real killer

  109. 109 Yepitshim said at 1:34 am on September 8th, 2012:

    I agree with the multiple personality theory. And rj seems Like the kind of criminal that wants followers. Judging from the way boscos secretary was so delusional
    About his goodness, it’s obvious rj/pj could coneople into killing when he’s not around.

    The pj dad Theory is also interesting. His dad showed no conscience about taking money from a dying little girl, classic signs of paychosis

  110. 110 Yepotshim said at 1:40 am on September 8th, 2012:

    …But there’s ambiguity leading back to pj as rj, because his dads excuse was that they were giving people hope. Pj claims this in season 1 as his reason for the fake psychic gig, and there are several allusions to the same twisted reasoning with rj.

    But what nailed it for me is watching pjs reaction to Kristina frye and knowing what happens to her later. He is clearly uncomfortable the more he realizes he can’t rationalize her apparent comms with the dead, and that’s when he starts getting closer to her. … Vanelt warns him in season 1 not to discount the possibility of true psychic power.

  111. 111 Nikiby said at 8:43 pm on September 8th, 2012:

    Has anyone noticed that the drawn face looks like Patrick. Ever noticed that Patricks eyes have a slight downturn on them just like the eyes in all the faces drawn?? Odd don’t you think?

  112. 112 yichung said at 10:08 am on September 11th, 2012:

    It will be an interesting plot device for a clip-show episode. What I see happening with all these theories for RJ=PJ is an episode where a special agent appears, accusing PJ of being RJ, whether he knows it or not, and Lisbon being in the interrogation that ensues. The facts that the audience knows will be reviewed as clips to give Lisbon a chance points out the flaws in the theory. However, the special agent whose team was secretly assigned to study the case with PJ targeted specifically will offer alternate explanations that refute these contradictions in the storyline (such as how PJ made himself appear to be in 2 places at once). We will most likely be told a theory of multiple personalities, a Dark side that perpetrated murders in order to cover his true intention of eliminating his wife and illegitimate daughter and blame a serial murderer. Near the end, however we will most likely see the special agent reveal himself as Red John only to Patrick, then disappear. Red John of course is not Patrick since that would require certain plot devices that would never pan out, just like Moriarty cannot be an alternate personality of Sherlock Holmes. However, it might be interesting to have the audience believe that a dark part of Janes mind has separated into a complete alternate personality and manifested in ways such as using his ability to hypnotize people, but making them carry out murders. It plays on our human morality, asking ourselves what we would make people do for us if we could influence peoples actions merely by suggestion. We, as the audience would always be able to believe he perpetrates his deeds by having other “weak” minds do his bidding giving his alter ego deniability.

  113. 113 RedRightHand said at 10:27 pm on September 25th, 2012:

    Actually, if you study in depth DID and multiple personalities, you will realize that the host personality (Patrick Jane in this case) is typically unaware of the other personality(ies). However, the other personalities are at least somewhat aware of the host personality. Split personalities are created when the host is in situations his mind cannot handle. Therefore, the primary objective of a split personality is to protect its host.

    So if Red John is a split personality than Red John couldn’t want Patrick Jane dead; because the death of Jane would mean the death of him as well. It almost fits. Red John doesn’t seem to want Jane dead or even suffering. Red John seems to want Jane to see and understand his view of things. Perhaps “protecting” him in some weird way as a split personality would for its host.

  114. 114 Vicki said at 8:48 pm on October 7th, 2012:

    Walter is Red John. He is charming, rich, and he has contacts everywhere, remember?

  115. 115 Bob said at 10:18 am on October 9th, 2012:

    I would put my money on someone from a Season 1.

    Just like in other crime movies, the murderer is someone you have met in the beginning of the movie (in a random scene), who is not that suspicious, and later the writer will give you 1000s of wrong clues to mislead you. In the end, a random guy from the beginning will be the murderer. Or Jane, but that would be too simple and already seen in 1000s of other movies.

    Also, in the beginning of the show, the producers couldn’t be sure if the show will last only 1, 2 or 7 Seasons. So, back then, when there was a chance that the show will last only 1 or 2 Seasons, they probably gave some “right” clues. And all things/clues that occurred later/in later Seasons are just misleading.

    So, imo, we should look at the murderer from Season 1 characters:
    1. Jane
    2. Van Pelt
    3. Jane’s doctor from the mental institution
    4. Jane’s father (a lot of episodes in Season 1 were about his father)

    Imo, the murderer is surely one out of these 4. All characters introduced later are just to mislead us.

  116. 116 Anonymous said at 7:58 pm on October 9th, 2012:

    I’m not sure why everyone thinks you need to have childhood trauma to have a split personality. Many mental disorders, like Schizophrenia, present themselves as late as one’s 30s or 40s, but usually manifest for males in the early 20s. I once encountered someone who claimed they had a husband that never existed and they became very angry when told it wasn’t true. The Patrick Jane is Red John theory isn’t perfect, but if it is true then it stands to reason the writers and producers are doing their best to give us a “red herring”. Of course if you notice in the season 4 finale, it’s Simon Baker doing the voice of Red John. This could also explain why RJ has so many “friends” in law enforcement, as Jane, being in law enforcement and being able to see the true nature of people–remember episode 2, season 1 where he notes that a witness has an extremely low threshold for hypnosis–would have ample access to weak minded people. Also consider the third season finale, where the assassin coincidentally messes up Jane’s plan with the room numbers by going in, sitting for a while, and then preparing to rappel into the lower room. That action alone doesn’t make any sort of sense when she could have just taken the stairs to the right room and gone in. Remember, crazy people don’t know they’re crazy. Patrick Jane may not be Red John, but from what the creators of the show are doing, it seems they really want people to think it.

  117. 117 Red John said at 4:18 pm on October 13th, 2012:

    I’m so glad that so many of you are already on this trail. I respectfully submit “Shutter Island”.

  118. 118 bogdan said at 3:52 pm on October 17th, 2012:

    The creator of mentalist said will be a surprise. If you listen the last episode of season 4, the red john’s voice is patrick jane actually, so believe what you like
    I really think that RJ is Patrick Jane

  119. 119 Zisteau said at 7:38 am on October 30th, 2012:

    Rewatch “Devil’s Cherry”, there’s is interesting and fast paced banter between Jane and his hallucinatory daughter Charlotte; she asks Jane “Does she know who you are?” in regards to Lisbon’s knowledge of Jane and Jane…does not answer and moves on…I didn’t catch it the first time and it is quite strange to me…

  120. 120 Tim said at 7:53 am on November 2nd, 2012:

    I Believe He Killed Red John in S3 Finale. And Now He Took His Persona. He iS The NEW Red John.

  121. 121 missy beth said at 11:03 pm on November 5th, 2012:

    I really like the thought that Jane is Red Jhon.I hope he turns out to be .

  122. 122 REDJACOB said at 7:03 pm on November 6th, 2012:

    While the last comment from ‘TIM’ is very curious and a path I had not yet considered myself. I do believe that Patrick Jane is Red John. I believe that all these ‘accomplices’ are actually under Jane hypnosis (who could do it better) and considering how smart Jane is I fully believe that in the last season fi

  123. 123 REDJACOB said at 7:06 pm on November 6th, 2012:

    While the last comment from ‘TIM’ is very curious and a path I had not yet considered myself. I do believe that Patrick Jane is Red John. I believe that all these ‘accomplices’ are actually under Jane hypnosis (who could do it better) and considering how smart Jane is I fully believe that in the last season finale if the final seon we will learn he is Red John. Plus remember the episode where the blind lady was playing the piano and red john was in her house and you saw his silouette while she was on the phone with Jane? What did he have in his hand……a tea cup? now thats not definative proof but another theroy is it could be Van Pelt…Im being a little like Jane himself and casting a rather wide net as of right now its still a little early to tell but watch how ven pelt acts and all the interaction she has with Jane. (there is something there) Then again its probably just Jane himself..

  124. 124 Ed Smith said at 12:49 am on November 21st, 2012:

    Walter Mashburn is Red John.

  125. 125 Matt Strang said at 10:53 am on November 26th, 2012:

    Been watching the show since it started, and from the beginning of Red John I have always believed him to be Patrick Jane. Maybe all the psychopath killers he has come across turned him into one. One day he lost control killed his wife and kids, and has used his job to help himself believe his not a killer, and while not working switches to the killer instinct. Kinda like in life how during the day you could be hard at work acting like a boss. But than at night your out drunk and partying. Red john would have to be someone used often in the show.

  126. 126 Lada said at 4:50 am on December 4th, 2012:

    I think Jane is indeed rj. Remember what dumar said. Red John Jane red John . I mean poeple think he saved Lisbon in that scene. But I think he was saving himself. When frye was kidnapped . Why rj wasn’t caught right there. When Cristina was asked by Jane about red John she said I don’t know what you are talking about.

  127. 127 Lada said at 4:55 am on December 4th, 2012:

    And by the way people stop thinking that rj killed panzer. It was Jane. And that moment in devils cherrie is definitely weird. She asks him who he really is. And Jane doesn’t say anything.

  128. 128 KIki mcgruder said at 12:51 am on December 7th, 2012:

    Red John is Patrick’s voice.

  129. 129 lillian said at 3:38 am on December 12th, 2012:

    Clearly Patrick Jane is not Jed John in one episode it show on the computer with Patrick talking to red John also he could of not killed the two people in Mexico

  130. 130 a fan said at 8:52 am on December 24th, 2012:

    I have had the thought of Patrick being Red John himself. but it really bothers me. I rather like Patrick to be the innocent man who will win Red John over at last.

  131. 131 Wolfiness said at 8:22 pm on December 28th, 2012:

    The voice of the supposed Red John in the Series 4 finale sounds a lot like Simon Baker
    to me. I agree with Dash that the writers may be throwing out false clues to plant
    the seed that Jane is RJ. My problem with Red John is he’s too clever, too powerful, too invincible, it makes him unconvincing as a real character – he’s more of an
    inflated bluff around which to build a story, like the shining box in Pulp Fiction.

  132. 132 suitology said at 6:24 am on December 29th, 2012:

    he can’t be there is an eppisode where time line wise would not allow jane to be red john. he was with the group the night befor the next day about 5 house latter they get called for a 6 hour drive to a murder that was red from where jane was.

  133. 133 Aidan said at 12:09 am on December 30th, 2012:

    As a child, PJ (an effete, girls sounding Ginger) was bullied and nick-named RJ.
    His only solace was Magic and he became prolific, gifted, ultimately earning his living this way. This developed into a Mentalism Act.
    His darker side became the prolific Serial Killer (RJ), whilst his OTHER personality became wealthy (meaniless to a psycho!) and famous ( Essential to a Narcissistic) Psychic.
    Upon discovering his wife’s unfaithfulness, he unhesitantly eliminated her and (as is not so uncommon) wiped out the kids.
    The pain of realisation caused a memory schism. Brett Styles is his Father and knows the Truth.

  134. 134 Aidan said at 12:18 am on December 30th, 2012:

    All Artists portray themselves in their work.
    The Smiley Face is a Self-Portrait (of P. J.)

  135. 135 Shewolf said at 12:44 am on January 6th, 2013:

    I think the writers want us to believe that Jane is RJ to keep the buzz going. They will insert more and more ‘clues’ to this as time goes on. But in the end, after making us all convinced PJ is RJ, PJ will be vindicated and not be RJ. PJ is such an endearing character, I don’t think they will want to destroy that image for the fans and for the series. Maybe I just want a happy ending, but I think they will add more and more clues making it seem like Jane is Red John, at the end, those clues will be explained away and Jane will be the wonderful hero most of the viewers want him to be. I don’t think they will ruin the Patrick Jane legacy.

  136. 136 KobeWan said at 9:30 pm on January 7th, 2013:

    For me the clue is the Red John symbol. Look at it, it hais Patricks hair, and, most important, it has Patrick’s eyes. pay attention on how the eyes on the symbol are drawn and then look at Jane’s eyes :)

    Also there are a lot of other clues but most important, the show has to be shocking :) I guess we’ll see when it ends

  137. 137 Carlos said at 11:42 pm on January 29th, 2013:

    Of course Patrick Jane is not Red John & of course Patrick Jane is Red John.

    He is not the guy that murdered Patrick Jane’s wife & daughter. That was the “original” Red John.

    After chasing him for so long, & killing Red John, Patrick realized he killed a part of himself.

    Shooting Red John is what split Patrick’s personality, when he became Red John.

    So none of Red John’s accomplices recognize him.

  138. 138 Matthew Perkins said at 9:21 pm on February 5th, 2013:

    I think there is no way Jane is Red John. I have watched every episode of the whole show.
    1. Jane would have to have a ton of accomplices to kill all the people red John did because he was with the CBI durin most of them.
    2. When Jane finds the note on his door from Red John, and when he sees the smiley face and his dead wife and kid he is stunned and its pretty obvious he didn’t kill them.
    3. If Jane is red John then why does Jane keep trying to find Red John.
    4. Why would Jane join a Police unit if he is red John. He wouldn’t risk getting caught.

  139. 139 just me said at 5:12 pm on February 8th, 2013:

    hi .peace .friends .am sorry to say that is possible that patrik is red jhon .look at the face ;) is like the smile hid Grief and sadness of his past .and what his dauther say to him ‘ did they know you ‘ .and she tell him to give up . because she afraid that he will find that red jhone is himself .and that bad because . hero becam crimenal .we retourn to ziro to the begining . the good work is if they find someone who was intelegent like patrik close to him like cho kimball …..

  140. 140 Matt Perkins said at 1:14 am on February 17th, 2013:

    Omg you can’t spell (just me)

  141. 141 PJ, RJ, SJ said at 9:13 am on March 1st, 2013:

    Jane is most definitely Red John.

    1. Jane Doe, John Doe
    2. Jane is a clinical/verifiable psycho/sociopath.
    3. Jane was in an institution (presumably for a breakdown, but false).
    4. Jane was kidnapped as a child and forced to live in the carnival. That is why he is PATRICK (Saint Patrick was kidnapped and enslaved for 6 years) JANE (he doesn’t know who he is).
    5. The perfect cover for someone trying to hide his identity (while helping the police look for him) would be to murder his own family.
    6. They are the same age.
    7. They are the same height.
    8. They like the exact same music (Bach brings him to tears).
    9. They both have soft voices.
    10. They have short hair.
    11. After escaping the carnival (possibly before) he went to visualize (where he became educated and “Saint” Patrick). This was before Brett Styles was in charge.
    12. He left visualize after his first murder at the barn.
    13. His history with visualize is a reason he has disdain for religion. It is possible he brought his wife there and she was being over-worked – so he killed the two.
    14. He would have been in his 20′s at this time, same age as Red John.
    15. He has little grins when he manipulates people – as if it’s a game to him (sociopathic behavior).
    16. He shows no respect for the dead – nor to the feelings for those who care. Drinking tea after murdering a man and smiling about it?

    17. Finally, Red John could be Lisbon. :) Just saying…

  142. 142 ConnorM said at 2:17 am on March 12th, 2013:

    Found this theory after hearing Jane apologize to Lorelei and telling Lisbon she (Lorelei) had it coming. I guess I’m late to the idea here, but add another notch for why Jane could be RJ.

  143. 143 devlin said at 8:11 pm on March 18th, 2013:

    I’m not really into tv, but was kept awake most of last night pondering the Red John/Jane puzzle. I even toyed with the idea of Jane’s name being derived from Janus (the god with two faces). Sadly though, it’s highly probable that the writers are using the forums to steer the plot, reacting to the chatter, so to speak.
    If you think Red John and Jane are one and the same,and that makes for the best story, you could probably bet on it happening.

  144. 144 Justin said at 12:21 am on March 27th, 2013:

    You are all thinking WAY too complicated, and assuming that the writers have this intricate plan of the series finale. TV show writer’s these days aren’t that creative, and they just make things up as the shows progress. The ending isn’t going to be that complicated.

  145. 145 sara said at 7:41 am on May 4th, 2013:

    Well I have my doubts and it just blossomed when I heard RJ’s voice in the last episode of season four. The way he said some words looked so much like Jane. I don’t know if you guys felt the same or not but I listened again and again and again, the more I focused the more I got sure.
    BUT I don’t think Jane is able to do all these dirty and dark things on people. And the split-personality-theory looks too complicated unless PJ orders and others do what seems to be done by RJ. I do confess if this is the case–Patrick being Red John, I will regret all the time I wasted watching The Mentalist.

  146. 146 Andrew said at 5:42 am on May 6th, 2013:

    It would surprise me a lot if Patrick Jane is Red John. Red John obviously isn’t a novice when it comes to physical confrontation. Patrick Jane is. Jane shies away from any physical fight – he does this throughout the entire series. He’ll run from a bad guy if he’s confronted to throw a punch or become physical in any way. It just doesn’t support that he is Red John who can obviously get physical (and win every time).

  147. 147 John said at 4:29 pm on May 6th, 2013:

    Col. Mustard in the library with the pipe.

  148. 148 James said at 8:42 pm on May 7th, 2013:

    After watching the episode this week, I came to the conclusion that Patrick Jane is Red John. It all fits.

    About the only other person it could be would be Patrick’s father. The narrowing of the pool to 7 individuals could have been deciphered by the DHS agent in league with Red John, but the knowledge of the memory of LiLi (Aileen) and whole way Patrick was lead down the path per the Lorelei video really puts it on Patrick. I can’t think of any other scenarios outside of his father that could be made to fit unless they throw logic out of the window…

  149. 149 Ed said at 12:08 am on May 8th, 2013:

    Show’s creator Bruno Heller just admitted Jane is NOT Red John:

    http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/05/06/mentalist-finale-season-6-red-john-list/

  150. 150 Bad cat said at 9:26 am on September 28th, 2013:

    Till the whole Timothy Carter death thing it was Timothy who was RJ, but later i think PJ is continuing those murders as a person with  mental disorder.i think that after this with TC, PJ sort of snaped, poped like a popcorn..with faces changing from RJ to PJ..i mean who could ever know things that only Jane knows…and the whole hand shaking thing..i believe its maybe not the physical hank shake…but maybe the psychical hand shake between the PJ personality and RJ personality..

    Here are some things i would like to point out : 

    …in the season 4 where Jane is talking to Lorelei she says why did they never became friends when they are so alike…i did not see anyone soo damm alike to Jane in the episodes

    …and the face RJ drawns with blood is just like Janes face…

    …why there were no RJ killings while PJ was in Las Vegas for 6 months…

    …how the hell did Lorelei found him in Las Vegas?

    ….why was exactly the CBI dude Luther Wainwright the one who got caught by RJ…if i remember he and PJ were insulting each other the episode before…and RJ does not like to be insultet in any way..so LW ended up dead…why it was not hmmm…Lisbon? Because PJ likes her and think as a friend/crush

    …and now you will ask me what are the other suspects doing in the series…and i wil tell you that they are nothing but distractions…just to keep us away from Jane in the first place….and on the other hand doing misunderstandings with PJ s mind…like for example the girl in the graveyard was sent from a disciple just to mindfuck PJ and the person with the baseball hat could be any of them…

    ….in the series we can see that PJ is very good at faking things…from his mental acts to his behaviour…like when he was in a verbal fight with Luther, even Lisbon believed all of that but it was just an act….

    …somehow RJ is always one step ahead of PJ…wich is impossible…he knows his every move, his every tought and his every trick…

    ….in my opinion this all is just to turn PJ a RJ himself at the end and to make him crazy

    …when PJ lost his memory he was a complete different person….

    …nobody did not know about the meeting between Gale Bertram and PJ….

    …how did RJ knew that PJ is going to the graveyard just when he saw the happy anniversary note on his car…PJ when arrived there was not looking around for RJ, but he was looking in the graves, and why he hipnotized the girl and said to Lisbon RJ could kill her…he could instead leave her go and follow her…

    …also there is a big black hole in the series when James Panzer was killed by RJ…it was a great moment for PJ to follow Panzer privately just to get in trouble with RJ as he always did before…but this time he didnt….

    …why is PJ keeping all the sudden everybody away from RJ…ok, he says that if anybody talks about RJ ends up dead…but i think there is something behind that….i think that PJ usually wouldnt care that much about others and that he would try to set a bait for RJ in that way….

    ….why didnt RJ take for example Van Pelt, or Cho, or Rigsby in the limo but exactly Luther wich PJ didnt like so much…and why is the group VP,Cho, Rigsby and Lisbon safe for 5 seasons now…

    …why did RJ wanted to “have fun” with Darcy instead for example Lisbon wich is also helping to solve the RJ case with PJ…

    …how come that Christina Frye is alive but was in contact with RJ….he hipnotized her wich is the thing Patrick does…and PJ does not kill her as RJ because he liked her..

    ….the voice in the limo sounds like PJ…

    ….”does anyone know who you are?”…charlotte asks PJ while halucinating…

    ….i am just not sure if PJ is RJ frome the beginning or it is half Timothy and half Jane…

    …i think that when RJ was thinking it was time for him to approach was the time in the mall..because he knew he has done his job but wanted jane to continue it…so jane with the mental disorder did so…but when the Jane persona was more powerfull in his head than the RJ persona then the disciples and the clues where there to mess up janes head again…

    …and whats with the happy memory thingy only Pj knew ;)

    .. Also Red John guessed all the suspects correct which is impossible since how would he know which people did Jane shake hands with.

    …Its feels like Jane is Red John. Whether its a case of multiple personality disorder perhaps..

    ….i really love PJ as a character and would not like an ending where Lisbon has to shoot him or something like that :( 

  151. 151 Don said at 1:45 pm on October 24th, 2013:

    saw the first three episodes from this year on demand-

    In the series openner, Lisbon wants to track the 7 suspects via thier cell phones- Jane says no- Lisbon does it behind his back-

    she also tells Van Pelt who the 7 suspects are, again against Jane’s wishes. At the end of the episode- Lisbon is knocked out and the smiley face is painted on her face- Is Jane teaching her a lession?

    Also, at the beginning there is a baseball player, who’s wife has been murdered. Jane creates a situation in which the guy gets killed and so is a cop. When the head CBI guy is chewing Jane out about the dead cop- his callous response is – “I said I was sorry”. Very sociopathic-
    Oh- why did the baseball player kill his wife- she said she was going to leave him- Is that why Jane killed his wife???????

    When u re-watch the episodes with the premise Jane is Red John- it is stange how much u can see it—– but it could all be a red herring-

    One really strange thought- the biggest shock would be- If Lisbon were red john- and Jane knew that and was just trying
    to get close to her the entire time. That would be freaky- my money is on Patrick- 50% chance- better than anyone else

  152. 152 Chris said at 10:42 pm on October 31st, 2013:

    Only with the episodes this season did I come to this conclusion. The more I think about it? The more likely I find it that Jane and John are actually the same physical person.
    Just because we haven’t discovered the trauma that caused the split, doesn’t mean the trauma doesn’t exist. In point of fact, if this is truly the situation, it would be something deliberately concealed until the reveal that they are the same person.
    Am I 100% certain that this theory is right? No. But I’m rather more certain about it than any others I’ve seen.

  153. 153 Chris said at 10:57 pm on October 31st, 2013:

    Sorry, hit Submit before finishing what I wanted to say.

    There are certain facts that strongly hint that they are the same person. Proof? No. But definitely support.

    1: John always appears to be multiple steps ahead of Jane. Since Jane is, quite literally, always the smartest man in the room, it is hard to conceive of someone even better at it.
    2: John killed “a happy memory” of Jane’s- specifically, he slaughtered a young woman from Jane’s past. The memory in question? Nobody knew about it. Only Jane and the woman were there for it, and he never spoke of it. How, then, did John know about it?
    3: John knew the 7 people Jane had narrowed the list down to. Although this may be the weakest of the 3, it is still important. There were many directions Jane could have gone with the information he had been given, and he only narrowed it down to those 7 via a series of weighted “values” attached to pieces of information- values that would undoubtedly have been granted different weight by different people. Yet John narrowed it down to the same 7.


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